My line up... Any comments?

[nickatzou]

I would like to know if other salons use more than one HP? This is the way i have thought up my line up:

1 X Mystic
1 X KBL T200 Stand Up
2 X KBL 4500 100watt/3 facials
2 X KBL 6800 CPI P2
2 X Iso Italia L28 (HP)
1 X Iso Italia L33 (HP)

[W8INLINE]

You have a vary similar setup to mine nick... with the right pricing you'll kick a$$....

I actually am in the proccess of eliminating ALL low pressure beds with the exception of my standup.... I have been toying with this idea for the last 2-3 years.....and I always come to the same conclusion.....kai gamo ta setups!!!

[sunsally]

Nick-

When I read your lineup the first time, my eyes "saw" you having two laydowns and 1 standup hp.

In reality, you have two "smaller" (but still more than adequate!) lay down HP's and then one "bigger" (but not significantly so) HP. Same manufacturer, same general dynamics for good or bad (e.g. % UVB, cooling, looks,...).

If you want to start with 2 HP (which I think is not a bad plan), my inclination would be 1 laydown and 1 standup. Most markets prefer laydowns - but standups can be sold well as a "go back and forth", fewer "hot spots", different coverage, etc. Then - after you are open for awhile - see if you have the demand to bring in a 3rd. Probably another laydown, probably the same as the first but maybe your "market" will dictate that you bring in mattress or the latest/greatest or less UVB or something else. At the cost of HP - I wouldn't want to "overbuy" initially or get it wrong.

[W8INLINE]

Ann....one thing to factor in, is that he is from europe....

going ann's route I would slightly change the lineup to

1 X Mystic

1 X KBL T200 Stand Up
2 X KBL 6800 CPI P2

1 X Iso Italia V28 (HP)
2 X Iso Italia L33 (HP)

[sunsally]

Yea, I saw the Europe which is part of why I didn't mess around with the rest of the mix too much.

I'm not sure what the new European standards will mean for you because I'm not up on them fully - make sure you are. I know they limit exposure, but not sure if it is based on MED or what exactly to know what equipment will make more/less sense.

That said - I was thinking the same thing - 1 L33, 1 V28 (vertical - stand up). I'd still hold off on the 2nd L33 until you build demand - but I suspect it will be the 3rd you'll add if/when you add it. I just wouldn't do it upfront.

[W8INLINE]

I disagree...

I think it's more important to have more HP than LP... explaining high pressure is harder when the doors are closed.... most tanners are familiar with regular beds so there is no need to tour them on that.... having HP available when the customers walk in is a huge factor not many people here have ever talked about....


then again.... most people on tantoday EFT/Unlimited based, tanning 400 people a day making the same amount his 3 HP's have the potential in making tanning at 50% cap.

[sunsally]

Well w8inline (since you and I are having our own private tete-a-tete thread here....)

I certainly wouldn't put in another LP bed in it's place.

I'd leave one room open, big enough and wired for HP.

Since HP is not used as often within a given time frame as LP, a couple of units can service a LOT of customers. My only thinking is - most salons, initially, don't have 100 people walking through the door. So start with 2, save the $40K (or equivalent Greek currency) initially, and add it when you need it. Hopefully that is the first month. But if it isn't until the end of the first year, you haven't tied up that extra money for a unit that isn't yet fully utilized.

Basically you are opening with 2 nice HP, 2 big VHR, a strong standup (so effectively another VHR), a spray -- and the two base beds, if he sticks with those. Depending on market and the European tanning changes, I might change those to a small VHR or vhr combo unit (like the juiced KBL 4500 with 160's on top and facials instead of full 100's). But again - depends on his competition and the regulations - and I'm not well versed in either.

Nickatzou -- your turn - tell us more about your location/market/clients and the changing regulations!

[W8INLINE]

Originally Posted by sunsally

Since HP is not used as often within a given time frame as LP, a couple of units can service a LOT of customers.

I agree with you ann....exept when it comes to comments like the one above....

Every market is different....true.... but the right HP unit, along with the right pricing, and your HP WILL outnumber the low pressures in volume.

Last time I was in greece, EFT's were unheard of...so a salon with clients not used to unlimiteds and lowball prices with salons in every corner would be able to fully take advantage of a good point system with HP in the mix. Things might be different in Athens with 9 million people than the island I am from....who knows!!!

[sunsally]

LOL - I struggled with the wording on that sentence to make it clear, and obviously I failed. We continue to be in agreement my friend!

What I was trying to say was -- the average customer that is an HP customer may come 2-5x/month. The average customer that is a base bed customer may come 2-5x/week. An average VHR customer somewhere between.

My point was that with 2 HP - if you can service 35 customers/day each, this could translate to 400-1100 unique customers/month (coming 2-5 times each). So - that might be plenty for "most" newly opening salons. But again - depends on demos and competition to be sure!

[nickatzou]

Hello... again and thanks for the debate! I was thinking of that as my starting line up and then add the V28 a year later. HP is new in greece i think only one person has one in athens and that isnt a full HP it is a half and half. The market here is in the begining(US about 20-25 years ago) Roughly under 20 salons to service 5-6million people. Keep in mind that because it is new, not as many people tan as in the US. My competition is far away, but the best bed they have is Excellence 800 series Ergoline and only one person has the 950 Ergoline which is the half and half. I just have to brain wash all my customers why HP is better than base and VHR. I will have screens in every room for advertising purposes so i can definately throw in some HP advertising on them. The pricing here is much higher than the US. Unlimited which i will not offer is 120-150 Euros a month (190-240 US dollars a month). The reason i will not offer it is because if someone buys a package they will not use it to that extent. Here most places will not let you tan every day. Only every other day! The reason i did not want to put more than one L33 is because i will have the L33 as my VIP room. In a luxury room of 16 square meters (144 square feet) with candle light and fresh flowers in a vase and better service also. The other 2 L28 will be my step under. These will be in a bigger room than my VHR but not as "sassy" as my VIP room. Comments appreciated...

[sunsally]

Nick - Glad to have you join back in!

The tanning difference between the L33 and L28 is inconsequential. One will not be a "step down" from another. HP doesn't work that way nearly as much as Low Pressure beds (100W and HP).

Since HP is new in Athens, you will have complete charge of the education. In one way - that is a good thing! But in another - you will have to be the one showing why a bed that costs so much more is "better" than the best bed at the competition (generally, what you would charge for a session on HP would be twice as much as what you would charge for a session on a nice VHR like the KBL 6800).

IF you were going to try to do "levels" of HP, you would be better off using the Glammy (L18) and L33. But I would NOT recommend this!! HP is HP is HP. If you put in a "cheap HP" and a "nice HP" - most will just gravitate to the cheap. With HP you are more likely to put in 360 vs mattress vs standup and/or low UVB vs. more "aggressive" HP with more UVB (like the Iso Italia). But in all these cases, you would charge the same and treat them the same - just different flavors of the same thing.

For Greeks, with great natural skin color, if their goal is to get "black as I can", they may actually prefer a "half & half" like the 950. That has more UVB than HP to build more melanin to then oxidize. Of course, customers could also achieve this by going back and forth from your HP to your KBL 6800's.

W8inline can chime in on this because he does it, but in your market I would also strongly consider a bed like that in between your KBL 6800's and HP.

Line up could then be:
1 Mystic
1 L33
1 V28 (still think this is a good option from the beginning - less expensive, takes less room, get people used to switching back and forth from the beginning)
1 Ergo 950 or equivalent
2 KBL 6800
1 KBL standup
2 KBL 4500

In US pricing, this line up might be priced at:

$25-30 - Mystic
$35-40 - L33 and V28
$25 - Ergo 950
$20 - KBL 6800
$15 - KBL standup
$10 - KBL 4500's

Other thoughts:

-No candles in a salon, esp. not a room. Don't need someone to knock it over getting undressed and start a fire! Flowers are fine if you want (but an expense they may not fully appreciate compared to the cost). "Better service" doesn't make sense - treat ALL your customers like VIP's! However, you COULD provide a cold bottled water for your HP users or something like that if you wanted to give them the extra "oomph".

[RobertK]

Getting a VHR bed above the 6800 is pretty tough. IBED or something of that nature with a huge wow factor and 1000w facials may work. The 6800 is a great looking and tanning machine.

[sunsally]

Agree RobertK - KBL 6800 would be his top VHR bed. IF he put something between that and HP it would be a combo HP unit (like the 950)

[Brian Oshman]

For the 6800, don't get the CPI version. It chews through lamps. Go with the traditional choke ballast version.

[nickatzou]

Brian, Thanks for the add in, i always appreciate your knowledge. The reason i am putting the CPI is because KBL advised me that if i do not get the CPI it is harder to transfer it to the 0.3 Law when the law is put in my country as well.
P.S. KBL told me the reason they invented the CPI was to make the lamps last longer!!! How many hours do you usually get with a CPI?