The great "Red Box" debate

[Jon Engen VBG]

Boy you guys sure know how to WELCOME new people to a forum.
As far as our anti-kiosk campaign it's a marketing campaign to show the advantages mom & pop stores have over a kiosk ( available here first!) It's more of a pro video store then an anti-kiosk campaign (pretty sucessfull actually) but that's what that article is pertaining to and kind of the purpose of the post "the great red box debate" because this is one of the major issues in the video industry which is why were involved. It's a strength in numbers approach not unlike your guys approach to a new poster on this forum (thanks JeffK for your positive post).

[JeffK]

Originally Posted by Jon Engen VBG

Boy you guys sure know how to WELCOME new people to a forum.
As far as our anti-kiosk campaign it's a marketing campaign to show the advantages mom & pop stores have over a kiosk ( available here first!) It's more of a pro video store then an anti-kiosk campaign (pretty sucessfull actually) but that's what that article is pertaining to and kind of the purpose of the post "the great red box debate" because this is one of the major issues in the video industry which is why were involved. It's a strength in numbers approach not unlike your guys approach to a new poster on this forum (thanks JeffK for your positive post).

As the dots have been connected, it now seems like your presence here is part of this anti-kiosk campaign.

You brought in your link through your tanning beds, yes. And you seemed to have an interesting discussion going about the various distribution models in the home-movie industry. But when you didn't immediately fully disclose your involvement in the anti-kiosk campaign, again speaking only for myself, you lost all credibility and the motives of your presence here is now questionable.

[RobertK]

Why not disclose that from the begining?

[SUNNYDAYS]

I don't about everyone else but as soon as I saw VBG after Jon's name I knew he had something to do with the video buyers group and that is why the topic was of importance to him. I think this discussion belongs on this site because there may be salons owners who have video store.

[Jon Engen VBG]

JeffK are you trying to say that I'm trying to stop salon professionals from frequenting Red Box? Who has that kind of time?
I have no alterior motives other then I know many people on this site have video stores and are dealing with the same issues. My name on my post tells you excactly who and what I am. Don't be so quick to discredit people this is like literally my first post and you've attacked me 4 times. Relax!!!

[JeffK]

Originally Posted by Jon Engen VBG

JeffK are you trying to say that I'm trying to stop salon professionals from frequenting Red Box?

What? No.

I have no alterior motives other then I know many people on this site have video stores and are dealing with the same issues.

Again, I feel you have visited this site primarily with the intention of educating people about your campaign. And since that's exactly what you've done so far, it's not an unreasonable position for me to take. Do you disagree?

My name on my post tells you excactly who and what I am.

I had no idea about the existence of the "Video Buyers Group" until this thread. Nor did I know they organized an "anti-kiosk campaign". Nor did I know you were part of the anti-kiosk campaign. I presume that there are at least one or two others on this site who had no idea about these things also.

Don't be so quick to discredit people this is like literally my first post and you've attacked me 4 times. Relax!!!

Relax?? Jon, I don't use Red Boxes. I don't use video stores. For what it's worth my wife and I use Time Warner's On Demand stuff for home movies. Videos and kiosks and the VBG and whatever have little relevance in my life - personally or professionally. I assure you I'm quite relaxed.

[Popcornking]

Originally Posted by Popcornking

How much is the cost of a tan in europe at a in a coin-op or vending location? Can that happen here-at home in the USA?

I like this thread.

Jon can you give any insight on how to compete with somebody who ads a tanning kiosk in their fitness center or Apartment building?

The 24hr fitness center near us has unattended tanning for $10 a month--unlimited!

I've actually tanned in the Apartment building that has a $3 coin "tanning machine"--unattended and self-cleaning.

Where can I find out more on how to compete with kiosks.

[Jon Engen VBG]

Jeff If it doesn't affect you it doesn't affect you enjoy your day.

Back to the topic........
Anyways I think come December we are going to be seeing the shaping of the video industry if not then definatly by the beginning of next year. I know two major things are going to be happening.
1st- December is when Paramount has on out clause in their contract with redbox if they exercise it. That would make over 60% of the titles unavailable to kiosk and would make delayed windows on the kiosk all but inevitable.
2nd- Dec 7th Universal, Fox and Warner along with all the lawers involved are having a telephone conference with red box and the presiding Judge to determine in what way this case advances.
Even if your not involved in video what's happening in that industry to say the least is interesting.

I guess in some ways this is what's going on in Europe in tanning with the coin operated beds.

[Jon Engen VBG]

If you want to find out more about competing with kiosk in general or the latest news pertaining to vending. Our website is www.videobuyersgroup.com and my contact info is there you can reach me directly.

[JeffK]

It's fun to be right.

[xtremetan]

Jon I appreciate you having this discussion here. I own 2 video & tanning combo stores with 22 beds altogether. The video industry has nothing like this forum to give us support. So thank you! If it weren't for tanning we would have gone out of business 14 years ago. I love both aspects of our business so I would hate to lose the video. Because our store is bigger than regular tanning salons our rent is much higher making us need to make alot more money. I have tried to come with something to replace videos but can not come up with anything I truely think would bring in business. I honestly think within the next year the # of video stores will be cut in half. If I can not come up with something to replace them with we will be gone too. Redbox is the worst thing that has ever happened to our industry, it will be the end of the video stores . If we could get people to pay what they owe instantly like Redbox we would be doing great and could charge less. We have too much invested in our spaces(extra air conditioners, upgraded electrical) to move to a smaller spot. I hope the studios fight back but I know its just so they can get a piece of the Redbox money machine.

[Parrot Head]

I think the "grim reaper" is watching both our industries. I would never invest or should I say buy into a video business. At the present, I can say this about the tanning business also. I'd cut my losses and get out of video, but I wouldn't expand tanning either. I'd maybe try pizza. But, in all fairness to the video business, I have what I have today, because of it. I started a video store in 1984 and it treated me really well. If it wasn't for video, I wouldn't have gotten my start in tanning.

[RL4010]

Jon, I assume you are related to Ted. What relation are you? I am just curious, doesn't make any difference to anything in this discussion. I was video from 87 to 94 and I just remember the VBG as being a really nice help to video stores.

[Jon Engen VBG]

Yes I'm one of his 6 sons. VBG is family operation as well. We've just done alot of expansion into tanning. We're hoping to bring more of that kind of help into the tanning industry that we have been able to provide for the video industry.

[Parrot Head]

I added tanning to my video store in 1986. I was a member VBG then, but your organization hadn't got into the combo yet. I know your father well. Good man.

[JeffK]

Allright.. I spent some time and brain cycles researching all of this.. It's actually more interesting than I thought.. and I learned a lot..

But the conclusion I came up with is that you're wasting your time fighting the market forces that are driving the kiosk model.. Once the studios form their own digital delivery system a la the MP3 - it's game over for RedBox, and video stores..

The studios are likely using all of you to bide time while they figure out how to get rid of you.. or at least squeeze you into a fringe type of existence..

The only good news for you, that I see, is that it'll take them a few years to sort it out.

[EliteMike]

I'm sorry, but the store based rental/kiosk is a dead business model. Myself and just about all of my friends won't rent through a store. I use Netflix mostly and as their on demand offerings rise, I will have no need to even pop a disk in the player.

For the price most stores charge it just isn't worth it to me. New releases are often 14.99 for dvd, last time I rented it came to over 5 bucks and it has to be back in a few days, otherwise suffer the late fees.

I expect Microsoft to become a major player eventually with their new zune service. 1080p streamed to my xbox with surround sound, all without getting off the sofa, that's what I'm talking about.

Oh and I don't' have to worry about going to the store just to find all the good movies are out of stock.

I hate to say it, but I think I'd rather be in the tanning business than video rental business.

[engfant]

free dvd with every tan!

[Ezliving_Jim]

I can't remember the last time I walked into a video store. Blockbusters are closing as quickly as leases run out. Are any resigning leases? I'm surprised Hollywood Video has survived this long. Mom & Pop video stores vanished from my area a decade ago.

Red boxes are at local McDonalds but I have never used one. At a buck a day, I don't see them long term as a viable business model, but what do I know?

I think that video distributors should be happy to sell anyone who is buying now. DVDs are like CDs/VHS/Beta/Cassette/8-track/LP/45. Going, going, gone. Be happy you still have Walmart.

[unity]

iTunes and TV for the win!